@vikingfox71 as someone said, speculate to accumulate. A 4.5k Widnes crowd backs that viewpoint up.
@dan1 twinny probably asking council what they want for the ground!! Get the club that way !!
(sarcasm) before someone uses as a rumour 🙄😂
@dan1 half of them won't go again this season unless we get to the playoff final.
@johnny65 but they would go vs Wire, Saints, Wigan etc. You can't blame people for not going this season with some of the one sided games with no away fans for atmosphere. As much as we as fans want them to go, the product has to be entertaining and value for money to attract the floating fans that went on Monday.
Leigh and Wakey are exactly the same, they used to get next to no one watching them. Now Leigh get 8 to 9k and Wakefield sell out.
@dan1 There is a difference between Leigh & Wakey. Don't forget Wakey only had 1 season out of SL, to regroup, put big money in. Leigh piled the money into their squad to get promotion. Both have rich backers, we don't have that luxury.
It's a catch 22 scenario. It's okay saying the thousands that went to Wire on Monday won't watch the dross teams, but would be there if we played Wigan, Saints, Wire etc. But without turning up against the dross, the Club can't show the RFL that we are sustainable on gates of 2000 or grow our IMG score. You can't have one without the other.
Paulie xx
Yeah, you took about 4,000 to Wire, but..............
How many of that 4,000 will make the journey to Oldham? It's not exactly the longest of trips, but I'll be surprised if it's any more than a quarter of that figure.
Band wagon? Fair weather fans? All clubs, inc us have 'em, who'll turn up for the big 'uns, but when it's (say) 'Haven at home, and it's pissing down, they're sat in the house on the sofa.
Spelly.
I read a comment from the Wakefield owner responding to the NRL takeover bid, about the possibility of SL being increased to maybe 16/18 Clubs in the future. Derek Beaumont made a similar comment last year. What is lacking is any medium or long-term planning or direction (or any direction at all!!) from those running the game.
The sport has been side-tracked over many years by the ill-judged plans to grow the game by merging historic clubs and a dream of a game with just city based teams, totally ignoring the history and local fan base that has been the heart and soul of the game since it was formed. I am also still not convinced about what the French teams bring to SL, as opposed to growing the game itself in France and potentially, developing and growing the game within Europe.
Widnes with its long and proud history in the game and the consistent fan-base in the Championship, as evidenced by the turnout at Warrington on Monday and also in the Cup game against Warrington last year, deserve a place in the top tier of rugby league. As a Club, they can certainly offer as much, if not more, by way of local support than a number of current SL Clubs.
Allan Coleman has recently talked about Widnes being the "Wigan" of the Championship in relation to the development of local talent, which I agree with totally. I would, however, extend this to also looking to emulate the enduring success of the Wigan teams on the pitch. We should be looking to building and maintain a squad capable of winning the Championship, not happy to finish in a play-off position, every year. In my view, success breeds success and this would generate increased local support and sponsorship; and eventually the return to the top tier.
@spelly That is true, but it is also true in SL and other sports. In the recent Saints v Leeds game on Sky, the commentator referred to the great following from Leeds, who took about a 1,000 fans to the game. My guess is that we are certainly one of the best supported away teams in the Championship, if not the best.
What is important is whether we could generate a consistent home following, if we managed to get into SL. With a decent competitive team and the right level of promotion locally, we should be able to attract crowds at the same level as Leigh in my opinion. What would be needed is someone with the same level of commitment, enthusiasm and yes, money, as Derek Beaumont.
@spelly That is true, but it is also true in SL and other sports. In the recent Saints v Leeds game on Sky, the commentator referred to the great following from Leeds, who took about a 1,000 fans to the game.* My guess is that we are certainly one of the best supported away teams in the Championship, if not the best.
** What is important is whether we could generate a consistent home following, if we managed to get into SL. With a decent competitive team and the right level of promotion locally, we should be able to attract crowds at the same level as Leigh in my opinion. *** What would be needed is someone with the same level of commitment, enthusiasm and yes, money, as Derek Beaumont.
* Which is why I (and the hierarchy at the Lions) were hugely unimpressed when your name was absent from our fixture list!
** This might seem like a harsh question, and it prob is to be honest, but what are the genuine prospects of saying "Chemics" and "Super League" in the same sentence in the foreseeable? Higher than ours, no doubt at all there, but I wouldn't hold your breath mate!
*** The likes of Beaumont, and Ellis, who as well as being loaded, they're also genuine fans, are very few and far between unfortunately. I was talking to Ellis in corporate at our cup game with Wakey this season, and I've never met a more honest, and down-to-earth bloke in my life!
Spelly.
It's not up to us to swell Oldham's or any other teams attendance That is their problem. Taking 800 fans to any away game in this league is massive support, which should be but isn't an IMG criteria.Yeah, you took about 4,000 to Wire, but..............
How many of that 4,000 will make the journey to Oldham? It's not exactly the longest of trips, but I'll be surprised if it's any more than a quarter of that figure.
Band wagon? Fair weather fans? All clubs, inc us have 'em, who'll turn up for the big 'uns, but when it's (say) 'Haven at home, and it's pissing down, they're sat in the house on the sofa.
Spelly.
All this crap about fair weather fans is ludicrous and pathetic, a fan is a fan if he goes one game a year then he should be greeted with respect for attending. A hell of a lot of ppl get into RL through going to see big game like CC Final or Grand Final.
Widnes take more away fans and outnumber a lot of home fans but no points for this it just wrongly boosts the home teams attendance. If we ever return to SL the fans will return cos the quality of RL been played, Should we tell them not to bother as they didn't wanna see games against crunchie teams ?
@spelly ** This might seem like a harsh question, and it prob is to be honest, but what are the genuine prospects of saying "Chemics" and "Super League" in the same sentence in the foreseeable? Higher than ours, no doubt at all there, but I wouldn't hold your breath mate!
Not harsh, but genuine.
I think our prospects really depend on which direction the game takes. If those running the game pursue their dream of a big city world-wide game, then the answer is never. However, I am not sure where this would leave those Clubs not meeting this criteria - St Helens/Warrington (part of Merseyside team), Wigan/Leigh (part of Manchester team), Leeds/Wakefield/Castleford/Bradford Huddersfield (West Yorkshire), Hull/Hull KR/York (East Yorkshire).
At some stage, I believe that those dreamers running the game will see that the game can develop and grow, based on the historic roots of the game and develop from there, within the UK. At the moment, it seems that those who are running the game are not promoting it, but killing it off from the bottom up.
So my answer to your question is YES. I do see Widnes in SL within the foreseeable future, hopefully in my lifetime!!
Personally, I would like to see two leagues, with promotion and relegation determined by on the field performance, but subject to Clubs meeting a minimum standard based based on agreed criteria in relation to finance, support, ground etc.
As an aside and an example of the way the game is being run, Jason Demetriou in his post-match interview, when asked about London's prospects for promotion to SL in 2027, said it was difficult to see who they would replace. He said that it could not be Bradford (who are likely to finish bottom) as they had signed up for Las Vegas in 2027. This is ludicrous. The RFL have stated that they will not increase the number of SL teams in 2027 and promotion will be determined through the IMG gradings. Whilst, I believe that London have been 100% guaranteed a place in SL in 2027. signing up for a vanity game should not preclude a team being relegated. We will have to see.
It's not up to us to swell Oldham's or any other teams attendance That is their problem. * Taking 800 fans to any away game in this league is massive support, which should be but isn't an IMG criteria.Yeah, you took about 4,000 to Wire, but..............
How many of that 4,000 will make the journey to Oldham? It's not exactly the longest of trips, but I'll be surprised if it's any more than a quarter of that figure.
Band wagon? Fair weather fans? All clubs, inc us have 'em, who'll turn up for the big 'uns, but when it's (say) 'Haven at home, and it's pissing down, they're sat in the house on the sofa.
Spelly.
** All this crap about fair weather fans is ludicrous and pathetic, a fan is a fan if he goes one game a year then he should be greeted with respect for attending. A hell of a lot of ppl get into RL through going to see big game like CC Final or Grand Final.
Widnes take more away fans and outnumber a lot of home fans but no points for this it just wrongly boosts the home teams attendance. *** If we ever return to SL the fans will return cos the quality of RL been played, Should we tell them not to bother as they didn't wanna see games against crunchie teams ?
* Yes it is, and unfortunately, no it doesn't.
** Disagree totally, all clubs have fair weather fans.
*** If you do (but like I suggested to Frank, don't hold your breath) how many of those far from regulars at Wire, will / would turn up to (say) Toulouse at home on a Thursday night?
Spelly.
Wakefield got very few fans in SL before Matt Ellis. Im talking before relegated. About 5-5.5k in a dump of a ground. Much less than Cas despite being a city. Since he took over and built momentum the crowds have followed.
Leigh when we had the Championship rivalry with them were always the poor relations to us. Dump of a ground at Hilton park and 2k to 2.5k fans compared to our circa 3,800 at that time in the NFP/Champ
now they are both flying but at the time these thousands of fans didnt turn up, just the hardcore like us.
The difference from us is with 7k vs Wire and 5k vs London in games we are heavily expected to lose, no other Champ team would attract anything like that. Huddersfield didnt get much more for a free entry game, and with respect to Swinton, Barrow. Whitehaven etc, the dormant fanbase is in the hundreds not thousands.
Hence Colemans comments that we are the biggest club in the Championship. genuine sleeping giants at least in RL terms anyway.
