The simple fact is that the team we all support are an utter shambles. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask questions about all things WV. The honeymoon period and the we saved our club hysteria has gone. The club say there’s money for players, well bloody buy some, because what we’ve seen so far this year is beyond a joke. The coach looks a beaten man, play the after match interviews from the past 2 weeks and it’s a carbon copy. The levels of fitness shown by the players is utterly unacceptable. It’s not a pop at you by the way Flash, but the fans DO deserve to know what’s going on because don’t VIQI own 11% of the club? At the moment, there is absolutely nothing to be positive about.
Not doubting that for a second. Just think if we can have some genuine questions rather than juvenile pops at the CEO or me, then maybe they can be asked? Where have the club said there is no money for players? Completely agree about the levels of fitness. That, in my view, is down to the players not adapting to the requirements of part-time rugby and having to keep themselves fit outside the controls of the club. Do the fans own 11% of the club? I’ve never been quite sure, though I do believe “on behalf of VIQI” is a signatory. Problem is, if this is always the same person, how do fans have their say in the boardroom exactly? When you say the fans need to know what’s going on, what do you want to know? Genuinely. Not being facetious. We’ve had some really bad losses. No shying away from that. But that doesn’t mean that the club isn’t being run prudently and sustainably. They’ve taken over in 2019, paid off a load of debt, then had COVID two years running. Even taking in to account the donated ST monies, that will have largely simply covered player wages – because even with the support of furlough last year, that hasn’t been possible since the return to training at start of 2021 and with zero other income coming in. If the club went out and spent a shed load of money and we went bust in six months, where does that leave us? I repeat again I’ve not heard anyone say that there’s no money for players – I do think there is a issue in identifying and finding players to play part-time this side of the Pennines.
Why do you keep trying to spin any questioning of the CEO as personal pops?
I am not suggesting anything underhand is going on, I am not questioning the finances of the club. I'm not even questioning the playing roster - I for one did not expect us to be challenging for league leaders and/or promotion.
Its basic competence I am questioning and the rugby advice provided by the CEO. His track record since taking over is demonstrably poor. The coach is not competent and should never have been given the job - who thought he had the ability to be in charge of this once great club and on what basis?
Are you questioning this? You have the platform to do it. Do your fellow supporters a favour and start asking the tough questions, rather than wait until the horse has bolted like you did with Rule and co.
The supporters do own 11% of the club via VIQI as stated by ACape - so your line about not being entitled to know what is going on is misleading. You've always had a bee in you bonnet about VIQI since before the collapse, are you chasing this up? Why is there radio silence on what is going on? Are the shareholders not entitled to know why Sheens left? I would imagine the other shareholders with the same percentage holding know why, yet you are not pursuing it.
Why on earth, are people turning their attention to James, the CEO and the board, when the biggest and most alarming issue is a set of players who really don’t care and evidently showing that.
I could have missed it, but nobody on this forum has excused the players. They have let the club, and themselves, down.
However, good company directors and CEO’s set standards by leading by example, motivating, encouraging and inspiring. Keeping quiet when things are not going well is not acceptable.
I'd be more interested to know why Tim Sheens joined than why he left the club.
If the CEO brought the players and the coach in, I believe its right to question the whether he is upto the job. I do believe it probably is difficult to get players to come and play part time rugby this side of the M62 when the championship is mainly Yorkshire clubs.
Why on earth, are people turning their attention to James, the CEO and the board, when the biggest and most alarming issue is a set of players who really don’t care and evidently showing that.
I don't think one single person hasn't took aim at the players. But as Simon Finnigan said in his latest video, they are all in this together, serious questions need to be asked and the board should be giving a statement on what is going on behind the scenes to address this current situation.
<p style="text-align: left;">Once play starts its down to the players, whether or not they want to play for Finnigan is besides the point they should play for the greatest fans in R.L.</p>
Excellent response, agree with all you say there. on this board there are a group of 3-4 doomongers who given any chance will put the club down what you do should be applauded many thanks onwards and upwards
^ classic
The players should be getting a lot more stick than the board.
The bare minimum should be professionalism and effort. That's what they're paid for. If after that the quality isn't there then the question should be asked of the board about the squad maybe. Until then this is on the players/coach.
Thin squad/players trying with knocks is understandable after a while, but clearly being out of shape and blowing after 20 mins 3 games into a season shouldn't be.
Question for the coach though, if he didn't want pre-season friendlies to avoid injury fair enough but why haven't the players done more cardio/non contact fitness work just to shed the pounds? Looks like some have been to the same all you can eat buffets as some of the refs!
The simple fact is that the team we all support are an utter shambles. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask questions about all things WV. The honeymoon period and the we saved our club hysteria has gone. The club say there’s money for players, well bloody buy some, because what we’ve seen so far this year is beyond a joke. The coach looks a beaten man, play the after match interviews from the past 2 weeks and it’s a carbon copy. The levels of fitness shown by the players is utterly unacceptable. It’s not a pop at you by the way Flash, but the fans DO deserve to know what’s going on because don’t VIQI own 11% of the club? At the moment, there is absolutely nothing to be positive about.
Not doubting that for a second. Just think if we can have some genuine questions rather than juvenile pops at the CEO or me, then maybe they can be asked? Where have the club said there is no money for players? Completely agree about the levels of fitness. That, in my view, is down to the players not adapting to the requirements of part-time rugby and having to keep themselves fit outside the controls of the club. Do the fans own 11% of the club? I’ve never been quite sure, though I do believe “on behalf of VIQI” is a signatory. Problem is, if this is always the same person, how do fans have their say in the boardroom exactly? When you say the fans need to know what’s going on, what do you want to know? Genuinely. Not being facetious. We’ve had some really bad losses. No shying away from that. But that doesn’t mean that the club isn’t being run prudently and sustainably. They’ve taken over in 2019, paid off a load of debt, then had COVID two years running. Even taking in to account the donated ST monies, that will have largely simply covered player wages – because even with the support of furlough last year, that hasn’t been possible since the return to training at start of 2021 and with zero other income coming in. If the club went out and spent a shed load of money and we went bust in six months, where does that leave us? I repeat again I’ve not heard anyone say that there’s no money for players – I do think there is a issue in identifying and finding players to play part-time this side of the Pennines.
Why do you keep trying to spin any questioning of the CEO as personal pops? I am not suggesting anything underhand is going on, I am not questioning the finances of the club. I’m not even questioning the playing roster – I for one did not expect us to be challenging for league leaders and/or promotion. Its basic competence I am questioning and the rugby advice provided by the CEO. His track record since taking over is demonstrably poor. The coach is not competent and should never have been given the job – who thought he had the ability to be in charge of this once great club and on what basis? Are you questioning this? You have the platform to do it. Do your fellow supporters a favour and start asking the tough questions, rather than wait until the horse has bolted like you did with Rule and co. The supporters do own 11% of the club via VIQI as stated by ACape – so your line about not being entitled to know what is going on is misleading. You’ve always had a bee in you bonnet about VIQI since before the collapse, are you chasing this up? Why is there radio silence on what is going on? Are the shareholders not entitled to know why Sheens left? I would imagine the other shareholders with the same percentage holding know why, yet you are not pursuing it.
OK, so if the fans do own 11%, why is up to me to ask the question? Surely you can do that yourself. Have you contacted VIQI? Have you contacted the club?
Funny how it's I've "got a bee in my bonnet" when querying something that doesn't suit your agenda. I think the questions I (and others) asked of VIQI at the time were fair, and I had a conversation with Jason about it in person. I would still rather that the VIQI "board" was elected, as per the supporters trust model, but things are far more transparent with it now than previous.
The coach has had SIX games in charge with a squad he inherited. I don't think he deserves to have his coaching prospects completely written off. Likewise, I'm sure the board had plenty of say over what coach was appointed and it wasn't just the CEO. Are you saying that the CEO should be sacked because you think he appointed an iffy coach? Or because Sheens left?
Sheens was an employee of the club. He resigned due to personal reasons. I've asked the club, I've asked Sheens. Neither wish to reveal in the public domain, and I think that is a personal situation that ought to be respected.
Why does the club have to make a statement after every bad performance?. I couldn’t care less what goes on behind the scenes. Fact of the matter is we shouldn’t be getting beat at home by Dewsbury or getting battered away to Batley.
For what it’s worth RV, I completely agree with you, Flash has made some very good points. But you’re guilty of falling into the established trap of dismissing other people’s views by always asking for evidence. An opinion is not based on facts; it’s an idea or belief that is sincerely held but not based on evidence.
Just like the view some people had / have the opinion that the earth is flat.
I’m not dismissing anybody’s views or opinions but I do take exception to grown-ups verbally abusing people because their opinions are challenged.
I don’t think it is really a question of falling into a trap to ask why people hold the opinions and views they have - you could even see it as an attempt at having a reasonable discussion as to why people think or believe certain things and looking at ways we could improve things - in this case the state of the club.
I’ve contacted VIQI flash, I’ll will let you know the outcome, that’s if I receive one! You seem to be on the defensive the second someone questions the club, why is that?
I’ve contacted VIQI flash, I’ll will let you know the outcome, that’s if I receive one! You seem to be on the defensive the second someone questions the club, why is that?
I'm not on the defensive, I'll say things how I see them. I'm not as hysterical as some.
The simple fact is that the team we all support are an utter shambles. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask questions about all things WV. The honeymoon period and the we saved our club hysteria has gone. The club say there’s money for players, well bloody buy some, because what we’ve seen so far this year is beyond a joke. The coach looks a beaten man, play the after match interviews from the past 2 weeks and it’s a carbon copy. The levels of fitness shown by the players is utterly unacceptable. It’s not a pop at you by the way Flash, but the fans DO deserve to know what’s going on because don’t VIQI own 11% of the club? At the moment, there is absolutely nothing to be positive about.
Not doubting that for a second. Just think if we can have some genuine questions rather than juvenile pops at the CEO or me, then maybe they can be asked? Where have the club said there is no money for players? Completely agree about the levels of fitness. That, in my view, is down to the players not adapting to the requirements of part-time rugby and having to keep themselves fit outside the controls of the club. Do the fans own 11% of the club? I’ve never been quite sure, though I do believe “on behalf of VIQI” is a signatory. Problem is, if this is always the same person, how do fans have their say in the boardroom exactly? When you say the fans need to know what’s going on, what do you want to know? Genuinely. Not being facetious. We’ve had some really bad losses. No shying away from that. But that doesn’t mean that the club isn’t being run prudently and sustainably. They’ve taken over in 2019, paid off a load of debt, then had COVID two years running. Even taking in to account the donated ST monies, that will have largely simply covered player wages – because even with the support of furlough last year, that hasn’t been possible since the return to training at start of 2021 and with zero other income coming in. If the club went out and spent a shed load of money and we went bust in six months, where does that leave us? I repeat again I’ve not heard anyone say that there’s no money for players – I do think there is a issue in identifying and finding players to play part-time this side of the Pennines.
Why do you keep trying to spin any questioning of the CEO as personal pops? I am not suggesting anything underhand is going on, I am not questioning the finances of the club. I’m not even questioning the playing roster – I for one did not expect us to be challenging for league leaders and/or promotion. Its basic competence I am questioning and the rugby advice provided by the CEO. His track record since taking over is demonstrably poor. The coach is not competent and should never have been given the job – who thought he had the ability to be in charge of this once great club and on what basis? Are you questioning this? You have the platform to do it. Do your fellow supporters a favour and start asking the tough questions, rather than wait until the horse has bolted like you did with Rule and co. The supporters do own 11% of the club via VIQI as stated by ACape – so your line about not being entitled to know what is going on is misleading. You’ve always had a bee in you bonnet about VIQI since before the collapse, are you chasing this up? Why is there radio silence on what is going on? Are the shareholders not entitled to know why Sheens left? I would imagine the other shareholders with the same percentage holding know why, yet you are not pursuing it.
OK, so if the fans do own 11%, why is up to me to ask the question? Surely you can do that yourself. Have you contacted VIQI? Have you contacted the club? Funny how it’s I’ve “got a bee in my bonnet” when querying something that doesn’t suit your agenda. I think the questions I (and others) asked of VIQI at the time were fair, and I had a conversation with Jason about it in person. I would still rather that the VIQI “board” was elected, as per the supporters trust model, but things are far more transparent with it now than previous. The coach has had SIX games in charge with a squad he inherited. I don’t think he deserves to have his coaching prospects completely written off. Likewise, I’m sure the board had plenty of say over what coach was appointed and it wasn’t just the CEO. Are you saying that the CEO should be sacked because you think he appointed an iffy coach? Or because Sheens left? Sheens was an employee of the club. He resigned due to personal reasons. I’ve asked the club, I’ve asked Sheens. Neither wish to reveal in the public domain, and I think that is a personal situation that ought to be respected.
Do you not run love rugby league and this Widnes site/forum Flash? Is the answer not obvious? You are the journalist and also a Widnes supporter like the rest of us. You are in a position where you can ask this sort of thing. For reasons I don't fully understand, you seem unwilling to rock the boat by asking the things that need asking.
Yes the coach has only had six games, you could argue people are questioning him too early and he will turn it around. Given he has no coaching track record to speak of and has brought the team into the season looking unfit, bereft of basic skills and looking completely disinterested - I'd argue its not too early to be asking questions.
On the CEO, I believe he is incompetent and his track record supports this view. He was the one pushing to retain the academy after we all "saved" the club - a James Rule esque waste of money and frankly disgraceful given the financial position of the club. That has now thankfully been disbanded, what is he doing that warrants a full time wage? The coach and players aren't full time, yet it would appear we are in a position to pay an administrator to be full time. Wasting money on administrators salaries while the on field product suffers, sounds familiar...
Agendas? I'll tell you mine, I want this club to do as well as it possibly can given the hand its dealt. What's your agenda? You are the one shutting down debate, you've done this previously with the SOC debacle and that ended well.
You are in the unique position to question and report on this sort of thing, please use it and help your fellow supporters.