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Tom Gilmore

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(@sinbad)
Noble Member

@wrlfcefc1989 I'm not too confident myself in Amor  making many appearances next year.We could have signed another Ben Cross.An ageing pack leader with his best days well gone.

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Posted : 12/07/2022 5:11 pm
leggie
(@leggie)
Active Member

In my opinion (for what it's worth) I think that TG had a raw deal. The way that he was treated on this board, by one keyboard warrior in particular was, at times bordering on being libellous. Posting the same rubbish every day for months was appalling. On the pitch he didn't seem to fit in with the Dennis Betts's plans as he had Brown and Mellor as his half backs. Its no wonder that he lost confidence. I remember one game that he was played I when the rumor was rhat he hadn't trained with the first team for a few weeks. When he didn't give an Andy Gregory like performance he was further castigated. People should also remember that when kieran Purthill brought Jack Owens fromLeigh the same concerns were voiced and Purthill had to ask the supporters to give him a chance as he was a different player from the one that left Widnes.He may come back and crash and burn but I really hope that he comes back and proves the doubters wrong.

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Posted : 12/07/2022 5:47 pm
Mckviking reacted
(@ringo-bells)
Trusted Member
Posted by: @sinbad

@wrlfcefc1989 I'm not too confident myself in Amor  making many appearances next year.We could have signed another Ben Cross.An ageing pack leader with his best days well gone.

I hope so!!!! Ben Cross was immense for us in the short time he was here!!!

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Posted : 13/07/2022 4:37 pm
(@royston-vasey)
Honorable Member
Posted by: @northstar
Posted by: @torn-sock-1
Posted by: @northstar

I'm seeing the phrase 'he could do a job for us' a lot, in this and other threads. 'Do a job for us' is not good enough. With our average attendances, income stream from VIQI and general standing in the game, players should be recruited who are amongst the very best in their chosen position at this level of competition.

We've had FAR too many 'do a job for us' players over the years. I could 'do a job' in the Widnes team, but for the love of god they shouldn't sign me.

And I see this phrase or similar all the time.
Widnes have no standing in the game, and haven't for decades.
Players don't care what a club did 30 years ago, they care about whether they'll be at the top of the league and their pay packet.

Widnes aren't at the top of either of those, despite their "standing in the game".....

I agree, they do want to be at the top of the league, but when players (and coaches) are choosing between us or Batley, it 'should' be straightforward. I think your recollection of how recently we were in the top 6 of SL needs a bit of recalibration. 

I think that a lot of us would like to agree with you Northstar- that the choice should be straightforward. Sadly, at the present moment in time, it isn’t though.

The best, or at least, good thing about bringing in a widely respected is it brings credibility to the club, as does bringing in reputable players (like Amor) and players respected in this division perhaps (like Gilmore).

When all is said and done what will actually make the decision to join us straightforward is us having a good season and building respect outside of the club - let’s see how JK goes next season.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 12:30 am
(@torn-sock-1)
Estimable Member

@royston-vasey In general 99% of players are going to go where the money is. There isn't much of it at Champ level, and players are going to go for as much as they can get.
It will also depend on where they live. Players aren't going to spend a fortune on fuel to travel 500miles a week for a couple of training sessions and a game. That will be a good chunk of their wages.

Northstar - Widnes were briefly in the top 6 years (and it was already 6 years ago), and have never finished in the top 6 since Super League started. If you're going to pull that card though how do their results compare to other teams since then, even "little old Batley"? They've nearly gone to the wall, they've had to sell players and they're probably hearing that the club don't have a pot to piss in.

Why should it be straight forward? The arrogance on this board is astounding. Batley have finished above Widnes for a few years I would guess.

Contrast that to Widnes who always "fail", especially according to their fans, quite a few of whom still live in the 80's and 90's judging by the comments.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 8:09 am
Robbo, Vikingfox71 and JJ65 reacted
(@royston-vasey)
Honorable Member

@torn-sock-1 agree with what you say but would factor in the ‘daytime job’ for all the lads who are semi-pro. If they have a well paying job outside of the game I think that would have an impact on how far they wanted to travel to train two or three times a week.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 8:18 am
(@farnworth-viking)
Prominent Member

I see Gilmore is in 4th place in the goal kicking and points scoring charts for our division this season, just one behind Inu, who must have had a lot more attempts at Leigh.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 10:13 am
(@viking-man)
Reputable Member

We obviously need to replace Matty Smith next year, I think if Gilmore hadn't played for us previously he would have been one that was mentioned on this board as a potential target.  

I didn't rate Gilmore last time he was here and felt we were always waiting for him to take his chance - but that doesn't mean to say he's the same player now.  To get a good Championship scrum half is difficult so I'm pleased he's joining us.  

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Posted : 14/07/2022 10:35 am
(@sunny)
Honorable Member

@viking-man. Is he actually joining us, when was this announced?

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Posted : 14/07/2022 10:46 am
 JJ65
(@richard-richard)
Estimable Member
Posted by: @viking-man

We obviously need to replace Matty Smith next year, I think if Gilmore hadn't played for us previously he would have been one that was mentioned on this board as a potential target.  

I didn't rate Gilmore last time he was here and felt we were always waiting for him to take his chance - but that doesn't mean to say he's the same player now.  To get a good Championship scrum half is difficult so I'm pleased he's joining us.  

Does Tom Gilmore know he's joining us 🤔 🤣

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Posted : 14/07/2022 10:58 am
(@mick-george)
Honorable Member
Posted by: @viking-man

We obviously need to replace Matty Smith next year, I think if Gilmore hadn't played for us previously he would have been one that was mentioned on this board as a potential target.  

I didn't rate Gilmore last time he was here and felt we were always waiting for him to take his chance - but that doesn't mean to say he's the same player now.  To get a good Championship scrum half is difficult so I'm pleased he's joining us.  

When he was here he was like a scared rabbit in the headlights reminded me of James Webster who also was feared to death on the pitch. Maybe Tom thought he had no protection from the pack but half backs need to adapt to the situation. I am undecided if it would be a good signing or not, IMO we need a creative halfback.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 12:06 pm
(@torn-sock-1)
Estimable Member
Posted by: @viking-man

We obviously need to replace Matty Smith next year, I think if Gilmore hadn't played for us previously he would have been one that was mentioned on this board as a potential target.  

I didn't rate Gilmore last time he was here and felt we were always waiting for him to take his chance - but that doesn't mean to say he's the same player now.  To get a good Championship scrum half is difficult so I'm pleased he's joining us.  

Another case of once a rumour has been read and commented on then it is deemed fact on this board. He may or may not sign, though I would say it's unlikely but for it just to be taken as fact is madness.

Happens a lot more generally these days, and is why people starting nonsense rumours (Club struggling to pay bills etc.) is so dangerous, as the discussions usually snowball.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 1:08 pm
Northstar
(@northstar)
Trusted Member
Posted by: @torn-sock-1

@royston-vasey In general 99% of players are going to go where the money is. There isn't much of it at Champ level, and players are going to go for as much as they can get.
It will also depend on where they live. Players aren't going to spend a fortune on fuel to travel 500miles a week for a couple of training sessions and a game. That will be a good chunk of their wages.

Northstar - Widnes were briefly in the top 6 years (and it was already 6 years ago), and have never finished in the top 6 since Super League started. If you're going to pull that card though how do their results compare to other teams since then, even "little old Batley"? They've nearly gone to the wall, they've had to sell players and they're probably hearing that the club don't have a pot to piss in.

Why should it be straight forward? The arrogance on this board is astounding. Batley have finished above Widnes for a few years I would guess.

Contrast that to Widnes who always "fail", especially according to their fans, quite a few of whom still live in the 80's and 90's judging by the comments.

Not arrogant at all. I have full respect for the Batley's of the world, but their aims, achievements and traditions are way different to ours. They themselves have been quoted in the past as saying they aren't chasing SL.

I didn't say anything about it being straightforward. I said it should be easier for us, but it isn't, so something is going wrong.

And re: 6th, you knew exactly the point I was making - i.e. we've been a SL team in recent times and in the playoff at one point. If you want to split hairs for your own entertainment, bore off and do it with someone else.

 

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Posted : 14/07/2022 1:11 pm
(@torn-sock-1)
Estimable Member
Posted by: @northstar

Not arrogant at all. I have full respect for the Batley's of the world, but their aims, achievements and traditions are way different to ours. They themselves have been quoted in the past as saying they aren't chasing SL.

I didn't say anything about it being straightforward. I said it should be easier for us, but it isn't, so something is going wrong.

And re: 6th, you knew exactly the point I was making - i.e. we've been a SL team in recent times and in the playoff at one point. If you want to split hairs for your own entertainment, bore off and do it with someone else.

 

Unless you're a Widnes lad (And even now it's not that relevant) which player seriously gives a crap about achievements and traditions, almost all of which are before they were even born? I'm sure Sheff Wed want to be in the Champions league, but they're not.

Who knows what the Batley owners put in? Maybe their money makes up for the difference in crowds? Either way if a player lived slap bang in the middle of Widnes and Batley and travel wasn't an issue they're going to go with whoever offers the most £, not achievements from yesteryear.

Speaking of which how realistic is it at the minute to say Widnes are aiming for Super League? They have loyal and committed owners, but no money.

Nothing to do with splitting hairs. You're saying this is recent success to get away from the terrible point of being successful 30 years ago. I'm saying it was fleeting success, and since then Widnes have fallen off a cliff & are now further away from being a SL side than at any other point for a long, long time.

As a serious question, without someone local winning the lottery and pumping £Xm's in how long do you think it will be before Widnes are a SL side again?
IMO it definitely won't be this decade, if ever. It would be good for the town if it did, and I hope it happens, I just can't see it.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 1:36 pm
(@sinbad)
Noble Member
Posted by: @viking-man

 

I didn't rate Gilmore last time he was here and felt we were always waiting for him to take his chance - but that doesn't mean to say he's the same player now.  To get a good Championship scrum half is difficult so I'm pleased he's joining us.  

Aye,two years at Batley and he returns as Jonathan Thurston.Grady,Wilde,Tyrer,Lawton,Ince and Widnes still below average in a poor league.Spot the common denominator.

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Posted : 14/07/2022 8:40 pm
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