Toronto WP – Visa Problems

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  • #3478
    Frankg
    • Posts: 560
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    I see TWP may are saying that they may not be able to fulfil the 2020 season because of visa problems. Doesn’t this show the folly of admitting an overseas team into SL? Like any other team, they should be penalised, including possible relegation, if they are unable to fulfil their fixtures.

    What a joke RL is becoming.

     

    #3480
    CJ91
    • Posts: 683
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    Oh Dear. How Sad. Nevermind.

    Anyway….Ottawa and NYC to come!!!!

    I would be happy to see Toulouse in SL…..sensible expansion.

    I suppose you could argue that there are South African Teams in the RU Pro League, but they are bona fide SA teams not a bunch of Brits and Aussies living in Britain.

    RL needs to think very hard about what its purpose is.

     

    #3482
    Wombat
    • Posts: 29
    • South Stander
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    Shame😂

    #3487
    sandgroper
    • Posts: 966
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    As ever filthy lucre is at the bottom of it all. The SL is always looking for more money, notionally for the game but as we all know it seems to fall into the pockets of a reducing number of ‘old’ clubs.

     

    Most fans are desperate to see a well planned route to a more healthy game overall but this seems to be beyond Sky or the SL/RFL.

    #3488
    Viking Man
    • Posts: 159
    • North Stander
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    Interested to know what people’s opinions are regarding the hostility towards Toronto?

    They got into SL on merit getting promoted, so no handout like Catalans had.  I can only see this going one way with what I’m hearing, it’s too dependent on one man but maybe I’m wrong, without going over to Canada we have no idea on what the impact they’ve had over there is.

    #3489
    Frankg
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    Interested to know what people’s opinions are regarding the hostility towards Toronto? They got into SL on merit getting promoted, so no handout like Catalans had. I can only see this going one way with what I’m hearing, it’s too dependent on one man but maybe I’m wrong, without going over to Canada we have no idea on what the impact they’ve had over there is.

    It is inevitable that this venture would fail in the current format. I wouldn’t say that they got to SL on merit. They bought themselves promotion, paying as much for one player, as other clubs could only wish they could spend on their squad. The salary cap in League 1/Championship should reflect the ability of the clubs to come anywhere near the cap. The cap could be increased for individual clubs based on attendances.  This would make it a more even playing field for all clubs.

    In my view, the emphasis should be on developing a competitive North American League, with the likes of New York. Ottawa and TWP forming the nucleus of that league. If there is interest in the game, other clubs will follow.

    It could be helped by arranging say an international club tournament in North America, with 4 teams from North America, UK, Australia, France, New Zealand and other emerging countries, which could attract sponsorship that could be used to develop the game further in those countries. There could be a requirement for clubs to have a minimum number of players from the home country.  You never know, the RFL could use this format to develop the game in Scotland, Ireland and Wales.

    TWP have promoted the game effectively in Toronto and could provide some marketing ideas to other clubs and the RFL, but it simply does not work in a UK based domestic league with a UK based team consisting primarily of UK/Australian players.

     

    #3490
    CJ91
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    Toronto have 100% earned their place in the SL through winning on the pitch, that’s true.

    But, in a game not awash with money Transatlantic matches are unnecessary. Especially when you want to have basically amateur teams watched by 400 people travelling over there.

     

     

    #3491
    Viking Man
    • Posts: 159
    • North Stander
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    I don’t understand what you’re trying to say about amateur teams, it’s not written very well?

    In a game not awash with money, why turn away clubs that have it?  I know there’s rumours of issues there but they can still sign Sonny Bill Williams on a multi million pound salary.  Not many/any clubs can do that.  And of course they earned their place in SL, having money doesn’t entitle you to winning the league, just ask Warrington.

    The away fan is obsolete in rugby league now,  think about it.  The game doesn’t value away fans and hasn’t for years (a member of staff at the RFL actually agreed with me on this one recently).  London, Catalans, but clubs like Huddersfield, Wakefield genuinely have poor away support.  I’m not suggesting Toronto are my second team or anything, but I think we need to be careful chasing people out the game who could bring value because people can’t adapt.

    #3492
    sandgroper
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    Don’t think anyone wants to chase them away but rather see them flourish in a North American league. The suggestion of an international tournement in the US/ Canada, maybe with the South Seas teams represented sounds good and would spread an appreciation of the game ‘live’.

    The problem is at teams all want to be higher up the ladder and filling the SL with foreign teams means that our own clubs disappoint their fans with predictable results. The effort to climb up becomes an impossible task.

    Atm the new comp in France sounds as if its taking off ay last, and maybe tugging players away from Cats

     

    All this being said we can’t neglect our home leagues, pro or amateur. If we do the GB game will die.

    #3493
    CJ91
    • Posts: 683
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    What I mean is you are asking L1/ Smaller Championship Teams who are professional in name only with very low crowds to travel to Canada in a game with big money problems. I think that is pointless.

    This has been the case in the past with Toronto and will be when Ottawa join.

    You either open up SL and make into a Super Rugby style Global League and bring the big money American/Canadian clubs in to join the biggest British clubs or the North Americans have their own league.

    The current middle way is making L1 and Championship Clubs Cannon Fodder.

    I also think that it is unfortunate to have some teams playing them at say Warrington and have a normal away trip and others having to go to Canada, this creates an imbalance in the fixture list.

    On away fans, I agree with you to a large extent, although at Championship level I’m sure most chairman look forward to a visit from us, Bradford or Leigh.

     

    #3494
    sandgroper
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    The travelling fans are failing, it’s true, but take away the realistic chance of promotion, if the P/R format stays the same and how long will the support last with us, or Leigh etc.?

    #3495
    Frankg
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    Toronto have 100% earned their place in the SL through winning on the pitch, that’s true. But, in a game not awash with money Transatlantic matches are unnecessary. Especially when you want to have basically amateur teams watched by 400 people travelling over there.

    I agree that TWP were promoted from L1 and the Championship by winning the league/play-offs, despite the hiccup against London in 2018.

    The point that I was making is that with their money and a salary cap way beyond other teams, they were able to field a SL team in L1/Championship, making promotion inevitable at the expense of the likes of Barrow or Whitehaven in 2017 and the expense of Toulouse. York, Leigh or Featherstone in 2019.

    The salary cap in League 1/Championship should be set at a reasonable level that reflects game at that level. The fact that TWP could reportedly pay one player a wage that was more than the whole player budget for some clubs, makes a mockery of the competition. How many L1/Championship Clubs can spend at the £2.1m salary cap level, ignoring the various exemptions that apply.

    The marquee player dispensation at Championship level could still be applied, but at a reduced level (say 50% of SL level). The Financial Sustainability Regulations would still be applied, to enable those clubs, who can afford to because of sponsorship and support, to spend at or close to the reduced salary cap.

    Irrespective of that, my guess is that if the game grows in North America, attracting more North American players and clubs to be formed, it is inevitable that they will want to establish a North American league to promote the game in that part of the world. In my view, the emphasis should be on promoting the expansion of the game in North America and not simply allowing one or two teams to place their snouts in the SL trough, at the expense of the wider game in the UK.

    #3497
    CJ91
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    Frank, I agree mate, when you have players like Leutele playing Championship football they could blow other teams, including us, out of the water.

    We actually could have beaten them at home too, funnily enough.

     

     

    #3540
    Frankg
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    Will TWP be in special measures soon? Reports from a player speaking anonymously that bills not paid and players wages consistently paid late and unrest in the camp. I wonder whether McDermott will be looking for a job with a small town northern club?

    #3542
    CJ91
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    As critical as I am of the project, if it fell apart, especially mid-season, the PR for the game would be a disaster.

    McDermott to Hull?

     

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